New dbh champ for SESE

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John Harvey
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by John Harvey » Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:39 am

Bob,
Thank you for your story and thoughts on the issue. As stated before, I fully support keeping locations secret as to minimize foot traffic. I also believe that photos in many cases drive the appreciation for old growth individual trees and stands, promote conservation through awareness and even monetary donations, and inspire many who would never have the chance to see the trees first hand. I'm not saying there are not times where a photo might be harmful but in general Id say they do more good than harm.
John D Harvey (JohnnyDJersey)

East Coast and West Coast Big Tree Hunter

"If you look closely at a tree you'll notice it's knots and dead branches, just like our bodies. What we learn is that beauty and imperfection go together wonderfully." - Matt Fox

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M.W.Taylor
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by M.W.Taylor » Wed Jul 09, 2014 11:29 am

John Montague wrote:On May 15, 2014, Joseph Hall and I discovered a giant single-stem redwood while bushwhacking through a remote area in Northern California. Our preliminary measurements suggested this SESE's diameter was larger than Lost Monarch.

For independent verification, I returned to the tree with Zane Moore and Luke Adams. The difference between upslope ground level and downslope ground level was 16', so we painstakingly performed an even tape wrap at upper ground level. The result was 23.95'. This measurement was treated as 8' above average ground level, and Zane then plugged in Bob Van Pelt's functional dbh equation. This yielded a functional dbh of 27.2'.

In our opinion 27.2' is a conservative number, because the functional dbh equation accounts for an average SESE taper, and the taper between 4.5' and 8' on this tree is well above average.

We can say with confidence that it is a new dbh champ for redwoods.

Joseph and I have named the tree "Crocodile".

John,

What do you think the volume of this tree is ?

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Don
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by Don » Wed Jul 09, 2014 1:31 pm

John/Joseph/Zane/Luke/et al-
Great find!
Your mention of the multiple-stemmed Lost Monarch reminded me of a posting of an historical account of an even larger coast redwood.

A fairly substantiated claim is made in "Giant Redwoods of the East Bay Hills" in The Four Seasons publication from the Journal of the Regional Parks Botanic Garden, Volume 8, Number 2 (December 30,1988) of "Entering the hollow, one finds himself within an area circumscribed by a wall of solid wood, the greatest diameter of which is thirty-two feet at a disance of four feet from the ground: this measurement not including the bark, which would raise the diameter to thirty-three and a half feet. Four other cross measurement give a clean average of thirty feet, excluding the bark, or thirty-one and a half with it". Those having visited this remnant include such conservationist luminaries as Le Conte, John Muir, and Alfred Wallace (a Darwin contemporary).

Let us all toast those giants that once were...and revere (gently) those that still are!
-Don

John Montague wrote:On May 15, 2014, Joseph Hall and I discovered a giant single-stem redwood while bushwhacking through a remote area in Northern California. Our preliminary measurements suggested this SESE's diameter was larger than Lost Monarch.

For independent verification, I returned to the tree with Zane Moore and Luke Adams. The difference between upslope ground level and downslope ground level was 16', so we painstakingly performed an even tape wrap at upper ground level. The result was 23.95'. This measurement was treated as 8' above average ground level, and Zane then plugged in Bob Van Pelt's functional dbh equation. This yielded a functional dbh of 27.2'.

In our opinion 27.2' is a conservative number, because the functional dbh equation accounts for an average SESE taper, and the taper between 4.5' and 8' on this tree is well above average.

We can say with confidence that it is a new dbh champ for redwoods.

Joseph and I have named the tree "Crocodile".
Don Bertolette - President/Moderator, WNTS BBS
Restoration Forester (Retired)
Science Center
Grand Canyon National Park

BJCP Apprentice Beer Judge

View my Alaska Big Tree List Webpage at:
http://www.akbigtreelist.org

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yofoghorn
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by yofoghorn » Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:08 pm

Michael,

I think John will agree, but to my estimate the tree might make 20000 cubic feet but probably fewer than that.

Zane
Zane J. Moore
Plant Biology PhD Student
University of California, Davis

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tomhoward
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by tomhoward » Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:08 pm

This may not be the smartest question - but what is SESE? At any rate it is a very impressive tree. I need to get back out to the Redwoods soon.

Tom Howard

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Jess Riddle
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by Jess Riddle » Wed Jul 09, 2014 8:06 pm

Tom,

SEquoia SEmpervirens, the scientific name of coast redwood.

I bet there were several other people reading these posts who haven't needed to abbreviate Latin names or who haven't memorized the Latin names for species outside of the region where they live. They're probably glad you asked.

Jess

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Erik Danielsen
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by Erik Danielsen » Wed Jul 09, 2014 11:45 pm

I was one of them, but I sort of assumed it was some type of regional designation I'd pick up on and sort of forgot about it once I got into the thread.

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AndrewJoslin
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by AndrewJoslin » Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:29 pm

A photo can be taken that documents an important tree and does not compromise the location of the tree. It's as simple as that. For significant trees that are located very close to tourist focal point areas, Prairie Creek Redwoods comes to mind, it makes sense perhaps not to post photos that would bring unwanted foot traffic. One size fits all policy for photos of important old-growth trees does not make sense. Many trees can be photographed safely without harming them now or very far into the future. Good judgement is the key, every situation is different.
-AJ

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Erik Danielsen
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by Erik Danielsen » Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:42 pm

I think the concern may be more that if the tree's photo is widely circulated in association with its champion status, others who are less discriminating in regards to tree protection who come across the tree and recognize it from previous exposure to the photos might then publicize its location. I'm not sure I entirely agree with this method of protection, but it does strike me as ethically consistent. I mean, I know I'd love to see a picture of it. But there are a lot of beautiful photos of gigantic western conifers to look at...

John Montague
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Re: New dbh champ for SESE

Post by John Montague » Fri Jul 11, 2014 6:12 pm

Michael, I tend to agree with foghorn. I'd be surprised if it's over 20K. A formal volume calculation is on my to-do list, though. As I stated earlier, Crocodile isn't very tall.

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