Monster Pines of the Central Sierra

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mdvaden
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Re: Monster Pines of the Central Sierra

Post by mdvaden » Wed Nov 16, 2011 3:00 pm

Thanks.

That's very interesting and informative.

I guessed yesterday, later on, that the beam and scope's line of sight must be parallel. At first it didn't make sense, until I realized the second lower measurement would make up for the small difference once the measurements were combined.

But had no idea how to make the adjustments.

For the windage, it seems that one could also put a pole in the middle of a meadow, say 250 feet away, and the HD setting would let one know if the laser was trained on the pole and not the forest 500 feet behind. Then adjust the scope. Yes?

But aside from that, if it would work, isn't more distance better? Like better to set windage trained on a tip 1000 feet away, rather than just 300 feet away?
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M.W.Taylor
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Re: Monster Pines of the Central Sierra

Post by M.W.Taylor » Wed Nov 16, 2011 9:55 pm

Mario,

Your method would work for the windage but it would be difficult to center up to the laser unless you had some feedback as to where the center of the laser beam was hitting. The laser beam is a broad divergent type IR laser and not a convergent point type laser. When viewed through a night vision scope, the IR laser resembles a rectangular shaped blob that pulses. It's borders are nebulous. The inclinometer is centered to the center of the beam, which is about the size and shape of a car license plate at 1000 feet. There is a lot of slop there, especially in the windage axis, but it can be centered for maximum accuracy. It is easiest to use the feedback noise of the laser emitter to fine tune the windage..i.e. center it perfrectly against the target....just engage laser and the speaker will stop clicking and go silent when it picks up a target. You can measure the off-set by using the cross-hair tick marks...adjust windage so that the laser reflection is picked up by the laser's receiver with equidistant # of tickmarks for each side of the windage axis. This process takes about 5 minutes.

MIchael T.

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sam goodwin
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Re: Monster Pines of the Central Sierra

Post by sam goodwin » Wed Nov 23, 2011 8:35 am

Nice pines, you had me going there for a few seconds, 8.6' dbh? Wait a minute, its alot bigger then that! Then the light bulb came on, dbh not cbh! Thanks, Sam Goodwin

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M.W.Taylor
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Re: Monster Pines of the Central Sierra

Post by M.W.Taylor » Sat Nov 26, 2011 11:54 pm

Hi Sam,

Here is another picture of that 8.6' dbh ponderosa pine in Eldorado National Forest. Ponderosa, Jeffrey and Sugar pine can all turn into true forest giants given the right conditions.

My attention has now focused on the higher elevations of Eldorado and potential jeffrey pine champions. Will have to wait until next year after the snow melts.

Michael Taylor
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8.6' dbh, 235' tall ponderosa in Eldorado National Forest
8.6' dbh, 235' tall ponderosa in Eldorado National Forest

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DAKennedy
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Re: Monster Pines of the Central Sierra

Post by DAKennedy » Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:45 pm

M.W.Taylor wrote:
Bob, I can't thank Don enough for inspiring me to go out there again. I also think there may be some record sized Jeffrey pines there. I just attached a picture of a rare 7' dbh Jeffrey in Eldorado NF, not far away from Don's big ponderosa.

I believe the maximum size potential for sugar vs ponderosa would be (at least) 10,000 cubic feet and 6,500 cubic feet respecitvely. I make this assessment based on historical evidence and currently standing trees. The Whelan is probably the largest sugar pine in modern existence before and after logging. This is from John Muir's accout. The Whelan Tree is the General Sherman of sugar pines. The trunk volume alone for Whelan is 9,000 cubic feet. If you add up the branches and twigs I think Whelan easily exceeds 10,000 cubic feet of wood volume. Another "goose-pen" sugar pine in Oregon was reported by Douglas with a diameter of 18' at the base. The broken top was very big according to Douglas.

Sugar pine is truly the "king of pines".

That largest ponderosa ever recorded has about 5,400 cubic feet of trunk volume. I doubt this was the largest ponderosa that ever grew, but probably close to it.John Muir, for example said the largest Pinus ponderosa he encountered in his travels was in the Sierra Nevada and it measured 220 feet high and had a diameter of 8 feet (Peattie 1953) Muir visited these forests prior to massive logging. He saw the finest forests of the Sierra. The largest ponderosa he saw was no larger than the largest today. There is reportedly a 9' dbh specimen ponderosa growing near Chester California on Collins Pine land. I have not yet seen this tree. There is a small chance of a 6,000 being still undiscovered in some remote basin of California or Oregon.

SNIP
Michael Taylor
My apologies for reinvigorating this discussion, but I talked to a reporter for Plumas News who used to work as a forester for the Collins Pine Co. He confirmed that this Ponderosa, also known as "The Collins Pine" does indeed exist and is over 9 feet in DBH. Attached is a photo of a mural of the pine tree at the Collins Pine Company Museum in Chester (not taken by me. Found on their website).
THE Collins Pine.  Apparently over 9 feet DBH.
THE Collins Pine. Apparently over 9 feet DBH.
mural-Large.jpg (56.77 KiB) Viewed 1577 times
- Duncan
Duncan Kennedy
Student; UNR Environmental Sci.
Tree Measurer.

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M.W.Taylor
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Re: Monster Pines of the Central Sierra

Post by M.W.Taylor » Tue Nov 03, 2015 11:43 pm

Duncan,

I finally got a general area for the Collins Pine. Do you know ?

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Re: Monster Pines of the Central Sierra

Post by M.W.Taylor » Tue Nov 03, 2015 11:48 pm

DAKennedy wrote:
M.W.Taylor wrote:
Bob, I can't thank Don enough for inspiring me to go out there again. I also think there may be some record sized Jeffrey pines there. I just attached a picture of a rare 7' dbh Jeffrey in Eldorado NF, not far away from Don's big ponderosa.

I believe the maximum size potential for sugar vs ponderosa would be (at least) 10,000 cubic feet and 6,500 cubic feet respecitvely. I make this assessment based on historical evidence and currently standing trees. The Whelan is probably the largest sugar pine in modern existence before and after logging. This is from John Muir's accout. The Whelan Tree is the General Sherman of sugar pines. The trunk volume alone for Whelan is 9,000 cubic feet. If you add up the branches and twigs I think Whelan easily exceeds 10,000 cubic feet of wood volume. Another "goose-pen" sugar pine in Oregon was reported by Douglas with a diameter of 18' at the base. The broken top was very big according to Douglas.

Sugar pine is truly the "king of pines".

That largest ponderosa ever recorded has about 5,400 cubic feet of trunk volume. I doubt this was the largest ponderosa that ever grew, but probably close to it.John Muir, for example said the largest Pinus ponderosa he encountered in his travels was in the Sierra Nevada and it measured 220 feet high and had a diameter of 8 feet (Peattie 1953) Muir visited these forests prior to massive logging. He saw the finest forests of the Sierra. The largest ponderosa he saw was no larger than the largest today. There is reportedly a 9' dbh specimen ponderosa growing near Chester California on Collins Pine land. I have not yet seen this tree. There is a small chance of a 6,000 being still undiscovered in some remote basin of California or Oregon.

SNIP
Michael Taylor
My apologies for reinvigorating this discussion, but I talked to a reporter for Plumas News who used to work as a forester for the Collins Pine Co. He confirmed that this Ponderosa, also known as "The Collins Pine" does indeed exist and is over 9 feet in DBH. Attached is a photo of a mural of the pine tree at the Collins Pine Company Museum in Chester (not taken by me. Found on their website).
mural-Large.jpg
- Duncan

Duncan,

Do you have the location of this 9'+ pondy ? I know it is near Onion Mountain. Wanna go out there this week and measure it ?

Email me if interested.

Michael Taylor

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DAKennedy
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Re: Monster Pines of the Central Sierra

Post by DAKennedy » Wed Nov 04, 2015 12:03 am

Michael,

By Onion Mountain, do you mean Onion Summit in Tehama County? I know that it is on a 40 acre parcel of the Collins Pine Co.'s Almanor forest, probably the Collins 40 Park 5.1 miles west of the junction of state routes 89 and 32 on route 32. There is a small brochure that can be viewed and downloaded here:

http://www.collinsco.com/Library/almano ... ochure.pdf

- Duncan
Duncan Kennedy
Student; UNR Environmental Sci.
Tree Measurer.

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