"Scraping the Bowl"

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#1)  "Scraping the Bowl"

Postby mdvaden » Sun Jul 16, 2017 3:51 pm

Some months ago at my redwood pages, I added the following update:

The era of giant coast redwood discovery is almost gone. Research will continue but the days of hunting for largest redwoods is almost a thing of the past. The remaining old growth is mostly explored. To hitch a ride on the tail end of this era is amazing to reconsider ... like running for the last car of an old steam locomotive, and someone reached out a hand to help me leap on board the last train that would ever steam down the tracks. Discovery of new giant redwoods is vanishing like a whiff of smoke.


I posted something along these lines on ENTS some weeks ago, but thought the point was worth reiterating. I think it's applicable to the Giant Sequoia forests too. Recently, Zane wrote about possible potential height champions. But honestly, there's only one "champion" at any give point, and whether any remain is hypothetical or a matter of hope. The recent find of a 350 footer in the coast redwoods and a potential 20K trunk, confirmed what I shared that discovery of redwood giants is vanishing like a whiff of smoke.

It looks like some species may go into permanent limbo, while a couple others see a temporary spike of activity.

The fewer and smaller remnants brought back memories of 1980s and 1990s when a few friends, desperate for a "buzz", would resort to "scraping the bowl" or similar residue when their "stash" depleted.
M. D. Vaden of Oregon = http://www.mdvaden.com

200 Pages - Coast Redwoods - http://www.mdvaden.com/grove_of_titans.shtml

Portraits & Weddings - http://www.vadenphotography.com
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#2)  Re: "Scraping the Bowl"

Postby M.W.Taylor » Mon Jul 17, 2017 6:12 pm

Undiscovered coast redwoods over 350' are getting "as rare as hens teeth"
Same with 20k+ volume coast redwoods.

mdvaden wrote:Some months ago at my redwood pages, I added the following update:

The era of giant coast redwood discovery is almost gone. Research will continue but the days of hunting for largest redwoods is almost a thing of the past. The remaining old growth is mostly explored. To hitch a ride on the tail end of this era is amazing to reconsider ... like running for the last car of an old steam locomotive, and someone reached out a hand to help me leap on board the last train that would ever steam down the tracks. Discovery of new giant redwoods is vanishing like a whiff of smoke.


I posted something along these lines on ENTS some weeks ago, but thought the point was worth reiterating. I think it's applicable to the Giant Sequoia forests too. Recently, Zane wrote about possible potential height champions. But honestly, there's only one "champion" at any give point, and whether any remain is hypothetical or a matter of hope. The recent find of a 350 footer in the coast redwoods and a potential 20K trunk, confirmed what I shared that discovery of redwood giants is vanishing like a whiff of smoke.

It looks like some species may go into permanent limbo, while a couple others see a temporary spike of activity.

The fewer and smaller remnants brought back memories of 1980s and 1990s when a few friends, desperate for a "buzz", would resort to "scraping the bowl" or similar residue when their "stash" depleted.
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#3)  Re: "Scraping the Bowl"

Postby mdvaden » Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:09 pm

M.W.Taylor wrote:Undiscovered coast redwoods over 350' are getting "as rare as hens teeth"
Same with 20k+ volume coast redwoods.


Hi Michael.

Your exploration into tallest pines, etc.. may be the thicker "stash" down the road. And I still have an itch of curiosity about tallest Douglas firs. I find it hard to accept there aren't several more world's tallest whether in the redwoods or elsewhere.

Although maple is still a shorter species, I'm surprised Zane never found a bigleaf maple taller than the Humboldt Honey. Although, one man out of Oregon emailed me that he thought he found one or two slightly taller in Oregon, but he never got back to me after I asked more about what he measured with, or if he could take someone else along to double-check.

But back to my OP ... I'm glad to have got a foot in the door on looking for stuff. And others like yourself and Chris are the ones I imagine as the hands on the last car of the train pulling me on board for the ride. It's been fun, and hopefully the train has some coal and steam remaining.
M. D. Vaden of Oregon = http://www.mdvaden.com

200 Pages - Coast Redwoods - http://www.mdvaden.com/grove_of_titans.shtml

Portraits & Weddings - http://www.vadenphotography.com
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#4)  Re: "Scraping the Bowl"

Postby sradivoy » Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:44 am

What you guys have discovered collectively is the stuff of legends! Not only did you manage to get on the last car of the steam locomotive Mario,  but in doing so you managed to find the planet's largest tree ( not to mention the tallest hemlock as well as the unique weeping hemlock).Congratulations on all the extraordinary discoveries  to all who were involved. I can't think of a species that has been so thoroughly documented as the coast redwood.
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#5)  Re: "Scraping the Bowl"

Postby M.W.Taylor » Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:54 pm

With the great pines like Ponderosa, Sugar and White I do see more opportunity for new discovery. Also, they are vanishing in the southern ranges. Entire forests of ponderosa have literally disappeared in the southern sierra in the last few years. The pine apocalypse continues unabated in those parts, despite normal rainfall this year. I want to document the best examples before they are lost.



mdvaden wrote:
M.W.Taylor wrote:Undiscovered coast redwoods over 350' are getting "as rare as hens teeth"
Same with 20k+ volume coast redwoods.


Hi Michael.

Your exploration into tallest pines, etc.. may be the thicker "stash" down the road. And I still have an itch of curiosity about tallest Douglas firs. I find it hard to accept there aren't several more world's tallest whether in the redwoods or elsewhere.

Although maple is still a shorter species, I'm surprised Zane never found a bigleaf maple taller than the Humboldt Honey. Although, one man out of Oregon emailed me that he thought he found one or two slightly taller in Oregon, but he never got back to me after I asked more about what he measured with, or if he could take someone else along to double-check.

But back to my OP ... I'm glad to have got a foot in the door on looking for stuff. And others like yourself and Chris are the ones I imagine as the hands on the last car of the train pulling me on board for the ride. It's been fun, and hopefully the train has some coal and steam remaining.

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#6)  Re: "Scraping the Bowl"

Postby yofoghorn » Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:29 pm

When I said champions still remain to be found, I am referring to Sequoiadendron height champions. I do not think we've scratched the surface there. As far as Sequoia, I think that discovery is pretty much done. I think there may be more 20k's to find, but 350's are essentially done. There are a few small drainages that have not been LiDARed or explored. Otherwise, it's done.

Also, sradivoy, that tree is the planet's 4th largest living following three Sequoiadendron trees.
Zane J. Moore
Plant Biology PhD Student
University of California, Davis

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