Stateline Woods Preserve, off of Old Kennett Pike

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BeeEnvironment2020
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Re: Stateline Woods Preserve, off of Old Kennett Pike

Post by BeeEnvironment2020 » Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:20 pm

Hi Brian,

Your estimate of 101' to the first branch is not off by that much. I estimated the same height (100') to the first branch when I first visited this tree. However, after I used the laser-rangefinder, the height to the first branch turned out to be about 77', interestingly.

Does 77 feet make sense as an accurate height to that first branch?

I would have thought that if it was not over 100' to the first branch, it would have been closer to 90' or 85'. Maybe I will try to remeasure this tree, just to see if it is indeed over 127'. For documentation purposes, I put down my height calculations for this tree as follows:

Note that the base was downhill (below 0 degrees, or eye level),
-BASE: Sin(8) X 40 Yards,
-TOP: Sin(44) X 53 Yards
After I added them, I got a total of 42.38 yards, 127.15 feet.

I have yet to find a 140 foot tree in the northern ~10 acre older forest section. The closest I have got to a 140' was a CBH 11' 2", 137' 11" tulip that I mentioned in my first discussion post. This tree does have a chance of being taller than 140' if I did not hit the top, so I will revisit sometime soon and try to get a better view and measurement of the top. Photo:
Friend measuring the girth of this 42+ meter Tulip. You can just make out the top in this photo.
Friend measuring the girth of this 42+ meter Tulip. You can just make out the top in this photo.
Erik Danielsen said that the soil depth to bedrock and a impermeable layer called fragipan can often change the heights of trees anywhere from 30-40 feet often. Because George Fieo found the 146.3' Pignut Hickory (and that Hickory tree branched much lower than most other trees!) in the southern, flatter, and younger forest section of Stateline, probably the fragipan/bedrock layer permits the growth of taller trees. Hopefully I can do a report down in that section soon.

Thanks for your help on the identification of those 2 "unknown" trees. I really am amazed at the significant balding on the Black Tupelo. It is a modest tree, pretty small. As to the unknown Oak tree, Erik Danielsen thought it could likely be Red or Black oak, or a hybrid of the both, but Chestnut Oak now appears to be a possible option as well. I have to put this on my list as a tree to check back in the spring, when the leaves pop out.

Thanks for the help,

BeeE.

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bbeduhn
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Re: Stateline Woods Preserve, off of Old Kennett Pike

Post by bbeduhn » Thu Mar 25, 2021 8:00 am

BeeE,

If it's 77 feet to the lowest branch, you've likely got a fairly accurate measurement of the tree. There may be a higher twig but you're definitely close. A narrow beamed rangefinder makes it so much easier and enjoyable. I started with a Nikon 550, and it was very frustrating shooting in thick crowns, especially beech and black birch. I got a 440 soonafter.

Brian

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BeeEnvironment2020
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Re: Stateline Woods Preserve, off of Old Kennett Pike

Post by BeeEnvironment2020 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 9:18 am

Hi Brian,

Thanks for clearing that up. Yeah, the narrow beamed rangefinder has been pretty easy and enjoyable to use. It especially helps in dense understories and crowns, as you said. Beech has been the toughest tree species for me to measure so far, and finding a spot where I can see the top and bottom has been particularly hard, but all it needs is time and patience to finding the top.

Best Regards,
BeeE.

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BeeEnvironment2020
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Re: Stateline Woods Preserve, off of Old Kennett Pike

Post by BeeEnvironment2020 » Sat Mar 27, 2021 7:30 pm

Ents,

I visited Stateline again recently, and I measured a few new trees, which are not that tall or large, but interesting nonetheless.

However, I found out today that I made a error in my last tree report on stateline, where I reported the 2 very old tree specimens.
I just found this out today, because as I went walking into the deep forest, and traveled to that little "Island" I described, I could not find the tupelo with the balding to 20 feet high. I searched everywhere around the ancient oak and the 127' tulip, but I could not find the same tree. It felt very strange, and I thought it had disappeared, and I looked all around the old forest area. However, as I went walking up the trail on my way back to the car, I spotted the Tupelo. It happened to be on a hillside, and not on the island. So sorry for any confusion (The Tupelo is located on a hillside, not on the island).

Anyhow, after all the confusion, I determined the 20' balded Tupelo to be 93.7 feet in height, and 5' 6" in CBH. However, I was unable to hit any of the top of the tree, just because the beech twigs kept on interfering with the results, so I had to find a spot on a lower, large branch for now. Photos from today:
IMG_20210327_170531-min.jpg
IMG_20210327_170527-min.jpg

I also found another ancient-looking Tupelo (Balding to 10 feet on one side) on the opposite side of the main trail, and it was next to a sugar maple (rare in this area). As the case with the last Tupelo, I could not hit the top, I could only hit a lower thicker branch. CBH: 66", and likely 120 feet tall, but I got 106.05 feet for now:
IMG_20210327_165909 (1)-min.jpg
IMG_20210327_165920 (1)-min.jpg
I also measured the deeply-ridged oak (Thought to be Chestnut, Black, or Red Oak) also mentioned in my last report, and it turned out to be at least 119.77 feet in height (again, I was forced to hit a branch below the top), and 6' 6" in CBH. This tree is on the "Island", with 3 other ancient trees. Older Photo:
Has bend in trunk
Has bend in trunk

Finally, the last tree I measured turned out to be at least 113.57 feet in height (again, I could not hit the top), and 5' 9" in CBH. However, I don't know what tree species it could be. I attached some photos below:
Image of the bark ~20 feet high
Image of the bark ~20 feet high
IMG_20210327_164921 (1)-min.jpg
IMG_20210327_165041 (1)-min.jpg
IMG_20210327_165038 (1)-min.jpg
View of lower bark
View of lower bark
What do you think the species of this tree could be??? I was thinking maybe it is a hickory, but I am unsure. Any help is appreciated.

Anyhow, it was quite an interesting day out in nature. I cant wait to visit again.

Regards,
BeeE.

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BeeEnvironment2020
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Re: Stateline Woods Preserve, off of Old Kennett Pike

Post by BeeEnvironment2020 » Sun Apr 04, 2021 4:50 pm

Ents,

Luckily, I was able to travel down to see the PA State Champion Pignut Hickory (Carya Glabra) that George Fieo reported to be 146.3' and with a CBH of 8.3' in 2017, and I can confirm that it has grown taller and fatter!

I nearly passed by the tree and did not notice it, but thankfully I turned my head around and saw it off the southern trail.

After doing all the calc for the height, it was at least 148' 11" (45.38 meters) in height, and 8' 10" in CBH, up from 8' 4" in 2017. I scanned the canopy with the laser-rangefinder thoroughly, so I am pretty confident I got one of the highest twigs, but I will revisit within a few weeks to do another scan.
Family member with the Hickory
Family member with the Hickory
It was my first visit to the southern second growth forest at Stateline, and some of the tulips I saw could top 150' or possibly 155', but hopefully if I revisit I can check them out.

It was an eventful day!

BeeE.

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ElijahW
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Re: Stateline Woods Preserve, off of Old Kennett Pike

Post by ElijahW » Mon Apr 05, 2021 6:29 pm

BeeEnvironment2020 wrote:
Fri Mar 19, 2021 5:09 pm

Here is another tree that I found that I am unsure on the Species. It is located on the same little "Island" between the 2 creeks, right next to the tulip, and near the other old, unknown tree. Maybe it is a very old type of oak, as the bark is in very, very deep ridges, and shows some balding, although it is not that tall or large.
StatelineUnknownTreeNumber2-1.jpg
Here is another photo of the trunk. You can see some of the deep ridges, though this photo does a poor job on showing how deep they are:
Statelineunknowntreenumber2-2.jpg
Statelineunknowntreenumber2-3.jpg
Bee,

This tree is definitely in the Red Oak group, but without seeing leaves, twigs, or acorns, I can’t be more certain than that. The gradation from blocky bark to smooth bark going up the trunk suggests Q. velutina , but Q. rubra is also a possibility, as is a hybrid specimen.

Your questionable tree from your 3/27 post is Q. alba. The blocky, light-colored bark at the base is indicative of a mature tree, but the flaky, light-colored bark higher up suggests a not so advanced age.

Great photos of the Blackgum, by the way.

Elijah

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BeeEnvironment2020
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Re: Stateline Woods Preserve, off of Old Kennett Pike

Post by BeeEnvironment2020 » Tue Apr 06, 2021 11:25 am

Elijah,

Yeah, there are quite a few possibilities for the first unknown oak. Spring has just sprung in the area, so I should be able to check the leaves soon.

Thanks for confirming the unknown oak tree from 3/27. I changed the species of it at https://www.monumentaltrees.com/en/usa/pennsylvania/chestercounty/25912_statelinewoodspreserve/50994/ to white oak.

Yeah, I also liked many of those Black Gum photos I took at Stateline. I suppose they show a lot of "character". I really liked the one where it shows the balded-bark up to the crown.

Thanks again,

BeeE.

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